Board of Supervisors Work Session and Public Hearing for the FY2023 Proposed Operating and Capital Budgets and Calendar Year 2022 Tax Rates   4/27/2022

specifically addressing athletic fields and I understand our Assistant County Executive Mr. Trevor Henry will be kicking this off.

So again, approximate times, 90 minutes and 30 minutes and we'll work, we'll do our best to stay to that time frame or beat it.

Thank you.

Next slide.

Good afternoon, Mr. Krichenberger.

It can be found on page 57 of our needs assessment.

And Lance will be sharing with you the more technical data in regards to this discussion.

I'm sorry my monitor keeps clicking in now.

We were trying to check our connection over here.

I checked with our clerk to see if there was a technical issue.

At first we thought it was just us.

And I'm going to turn this over to Trevor Henry and be here for any questions that he can't answer.

And however you want to best manage the remainder of the time, Chair, we can play traffic cop on how questions are directed and who can answer them.

Supervisor Galloway.

How does it impact it?

The resulting deficiency would be, if we think it's six to eight today, and we implement best practices next year, that six to eight will then be something else.

Thank you, thank you.

Supervisor Galloway, we have not actually landed on an exact

It could be back to forward.

and so on.

I think we could get there, but really understanding what are the metrics by which we want to calculate that would be helpful.

We don't have that original concern anymore.

If Jason's on Zoom, certainly he could talk more about that.

It seems to me that that's not even really being discussed anymore because we're probably satisfied that the process we follow will be legit.

Supervisor Andrews?

Is that, was there synthetic turf?

So one continues with three to three and you know instead of it going well that's not clear in any direction but yet here we are.

Because I've seen the topology and the biscuit run area where these fields are proposed is right now just

So that's why the cost is what it is at those two sites.

sort of take into account the initial slope.

There's a, within the CIP itself, and Blake I'm going to say it's about $750,000 or so, which is to get us to the field themselves and then within both the, you know, very similar work would have to be done in both cases to build the grass field or to build the synthetic turf field.

I realize this is somewhat nebulous, but I'm trying to understand a little bit better the comments about those sports complex consultant and that process and who that was.

Can you off the top of your head remind me what they were that was actually brought into SAP recommendations out of the 2018 study?

Well, obviously, Darden Town, Western Park,

We've made some staff changes that have come out of this assessment to better support our facilities as an example.

Supervisor McKeel.

And I'm specifically talking about the dark skies and whether or not we can meet dark skies with the lights that would be proposed, you know, the new, better lighting.

So it would be something that we would have to look at pretty hard whether we can achieve that with these projects, but it would be very atypical to be able to accommodate a field that would have poles that are low enough that the power could be low enough that the light could be in the red spectrum.

So with what we could provide, what I'm hearing is that we could have dark skies compliance.

Yes, ma'am.

to this project, but that is they are requiring for that $1 million, I guess I'll use the word require, lighting and synthetic or turf fields, because that was the expectation that they had with $1 million.

but they are looking at that funding and if we don't take action on its use in this budget cycle, they're going to reallocate it, at least what I'm told, they're going to be reallocated to other needs of which they have many.

And that's what Ned told me when I had a conversation with him about this.

and the city manager's office was noncommittal but said they would listen to, you know, would consider anything coming out of today that I'm going to follow up with them on.

Ned was not that generous in our conversations.

But I'm talking to the city manager.

My understanding, and just one more clarification, my understanding is that, and it gets to what Jim was talking about, at Biscuit Run, we would have to deal with the slopes, which means we'd have to move a lot more dirt and flatten the property, which gets to what the extra expense was for.

OK.

All right.

OK.

I think that's all I have right now.

throughout the rest of the 1,200 acres.

And I think we are limited on how much pavement we can actually put in Biscuit Run.

We are limited on pervious and impervious.

Which would help, having it near the entrance would help with that as well.

Thank you.

Okay, thank you very much.

Supervisor Mallek.

I mean, we're looking really at two regulation fields that are then of the, that are of the size, so.

What we are proposing and what we have worked through in our concepts here would be four regulation fields.

So that's a different layout that we just haven't seen the plan for.

Because we haven't done the work on it yet.

So that's what you're saying is that's no longer the case.

Correct.

That's a huge.

That was a fall 2019 work in progress.

And so that was a question that was asked quite specifically a number of weeks ago, and I would still like to have an answer for that.

That level of field is not what was proposed in the CIP, that level of infrastructure.

I see information in here that when I go to the website of the company is just right on the website, so I really am looking for people who have our best interest in mind, not just selling us something, and I'm trying to separate where those concerns are.

Go ahead, Jason.

but they again will not, the intensity of play if equal to 30 hours a week would not hold up over time.

you would have to change the synthetic turf out the 10 years interval?

Did that answer the question?

Thank you very much.

You're welcome.

Where in the matrices or in our estimates are we incorporating the cost of replacement for the synthetic turf fields?

It would not be reflected in the documentation provided.

Thank you.

Supervisor LaPisto-Kirtley.

How are you doing?

Thank you.

is that the maximum, eight fields is that the maximum we can have according to our contract with the state?

Six to eight, and again, we're trying to locate those in proximity to the entrance.

Just as we would have to get permission from the state and amend the contract to be able to put synthetic fields in there and lighting, we could also perhaps amend it to increase the fields in the future.

We would just want to, in any change, update our master plan, which would come back to the board since the board approved what is there now.

where that's a possibility.

We've not looked at it at that level that Mr. Krichenberger maybe can help with that.

So it would take much more analysis to really be able to give you a solid answer on that.

okay well I wasn't like trying to go anywhere necessarily with that I was just asking so it looks like if we wanted in the future to build additional fields we'd have to go elsewhere because you brought up a 99 acre deficit in sports complexes but a sports complex also includes spectator seating and lighting and the only place we have that would be at the high schools is that correct?

That's more on the line of when we're staying spectator seating with the bleachers, but not permanent stadium seating.

Right, but even bleachers, I mean, we have that only at the high schools right now, correct?

We have portable bleachers at multiple fields.

Yeah, they're not permanent, though, and that's the key.

Along the, okay.

Not stadiums, but, you know, portable seating.

I understand that in either case for turf or natural fields at Darden Tow we'd have a full-time, we would need a full-time equivalent person there?

That's what we're proposing and recommending, yes ma'am.

that that would be the red spectrum light, but that would need more study?

Yes, ma'am, to see if it can be done and still maintain the minimum lighting requirements for safe play.

Because we have soccer, we have lacrosse, we have... Okay, help me out here everyone.

You're the expert.

Hi Jason.

Could you repeat the last part real quick?

So if we are for looking at turf, it was mentioned that you have specific types of turf for specific sports.

Correct.

So if you have four fields, what type of do you put in four different types of turf?

Well.

Synthetic turf?

No, no.

The material composition of those two?

The polypropylene.

Polypropylene for both.

That's correct.

All right.

I don't know if we're going to do a formal vote, but I think we do need to express ourselves to give staff guidance.

Comments, turn to questions.

Sorry, I didn't mean to keep you standing.

And we would like guidance, if possible.

Do we have a slide up with specific information on the guidance?

Well, it would be direction around one of these options or item number six, which is combo or other.

Supervisor Galloway.

Who dumped the material that we keep hearing about that got dumped out in the lands and then got redirected to the landfill?

It was individual contractors working under subcontracts with UVA.

So it was UVA's fields.

The park field that people have mentioned in emails.

So with that, I'll leave it there for my comments.

Do you have a recommendation of the six options, Supervisor Galloway?

Number two, thank you.

Supervisor Andrews?

But to do four fields at Darden Powell, to completely cover that area, it just seems too upscale to me at this point.

So where do you stand?

I'm basically suggesting that I would be open to the idea of one or two fields potentially at one location to try out

But to consider taking this Darden-Tao complex and turning it into really all turf, almost all turf, I don't feel like I can support.

Supervisor McKeel.

And I think we can do it in a way that does not add to the impacts on the neighbors around that park.

Supervisor Mallek?

So I'm sure it is no surprise to you all that I very much support number one.

Supervisor LaPisto-Kirtley.

I'm going to be voting for number one.

Supervisor Galloway?

I don't see how you can do two of four there and then not do any in other facilities where we bring fields online.

And not because you mentioned Supervisor Andrews, but in our order, Supervisor Andrews, any other comments from you?

I'm not against number one, but I would prefer number six.

Supervisor McKeel, anything further?

I am very supportive of that, but I think if we look at Darden Towel and Biscuit Run and look at the school fields and we think about this as a system for turf fields at Darden Towel and then the fields at Biscuit Run would be grass, that gives us a plant.

Supervisor Mallek?

So that's a given regardless of which choice the board makes today.

fields, not only at Biscuit Run, but just to assist with the maintenance and execution of the fields that are on the schools as well.

So that would be the extra training that's required to know how to do this to a higher level.

Some training, but with hope that we could hire someone that already has that expertise.

So would that then be a second individual to do the grass fields and someone to do the synthetic turf fields at Darden Town?

We were envisioning that that one person would do it all.

One busy person.

Yes.

And if you need to plan the comeback date and come back next month or something like that, I just really want to know what's going on on this.

It can't be just our four fields or five fields at Darden Town.

So we're not imposing anything on them that they don't already have.

Remember, half of the fields are managed by parks on schools that are not subject to fees.

And this was a way to make sure that someone wasn't just saying, oh, we have 10,000 people and so we want all of this stuff.

Sorry to interrupt, but just as a reminder, we have five minutes before our hearts stop.

Thank you.

Supervisor LaPisto-Kirtley?

Thank you.

That's the best we can give you today.

So I'm just reiterating, as of today, that's where we're landing.

Thank you.

OK.

We're landing with nothing's going to be changed because we do not have a majority to make any change.

The problem is we can't agree on how.

Which means that there will be no change to the current park policy.

I apologize if I didn't articulate that properly.

So it will simply be continuing business as usual.

That's right.

All right, we will recess until six o'clock.

And I'm going to scoot really quickly because I have a four o'clock commitment and I'll see you all.

And we will all be back at six o'clock.

I just want people to know I'm not leaving what they want to know anyway.

Thank you.

Good evening, everyone, and welcome back for our six o'clock session today.

And Mr. Bowman, I understand you will be teeing this off.

I'm the Chief of Budget.

Thank you.

And I'm getting ahead of myself, so I will pause right here in case there are any questions or discussion around these two one-time funding items for the housing fund and the Boys and Girls Club.

Supervisor Galloway.

Is that later?

So giving time to do both of those more like fall.

That's how many questions I have.

Supervisor Andrews?

All right.

Supervisor McKeel?

So are we responding to both of these or just the housing?

It's both of them have been brought in.

All right.

And Supervisor Mallek.

or repeat what you said because I'm sorry I missed it.

And so the proposal next week would be really to take that remainder of the project, which is not an exact number, half off the top of my head, but we can certainly bring that back next week, where essentially that funding would go into what's called the placeholder for the comprehensive plan and strategic plan update.

Thank you.

Thank you, Supervisor LaPisto-Kirtley.

Those incentives will come back in the fall, is that correct?

The developer incentives would come before that, most likely.

And the Housing Trust Fund, that won't be a permanent Housing Trust Fund, correct?

Yeah, I mean it was something you can access for other things if you need to, but the primary use would be... So it's not a permanent, got it, got it.

Would Deputy Executive Trevor Henry know about how much we would need to put in there just to... I'm going to, unless the board overrides, I'm going to call that discussion out of order at this point.

Right now we're talking about these two items if the board wants to bring something up on fields later.

Later in this discussion today?

We spent two hours on fields and we want to keep this here.

We're talking now about just maybe maintenance, repairing.

No, right now we're talking about the housing fund and the Boys and Girls Club.

If you want to try later on.

Right now we're talking about the housing fund and the Boys and Girls Club.

Okay, thank you.

And as we're adding comments, I support both of these.

And once again, I will pause for any board questions and any direction.

Supervisor Galloway?

One, use the positions right away in July and fill the positions.

We can't hear you.

Even closer.

Thank you.

That's all.

Supervisor Andrews?

The questions that I had were answered right there, that you can fill these positions and that you see the need now.

Supervisor McKeel.

In other words, from when to, I know now, but from when?

This allows the funding to be in place for them to be starting on July 1st for the full fiscal year.

The two eligible?

Yes.

So those three would have been in January?

Yes, that's correct.

I can't remember when that study is due out.

Now, certainly different departments may be in different situations, but that was more the thought about the staggering of positions than the actual compensation study.

It's all right.

So they said it's typically seven or eight months, and we had our first meeting last week.

I will say that I'm supportive of A, B, and C, and D. All right.

Supervisor Malek.

Thank you.

Supervisor LaPisto-Kirtley?

Yes, I'm also in favor of all four of these, so thank you very much.

Mr. Bowman?

And this is really just for any questions or other items that may be on the board's mind.

It's just any other things from the board you're asking for.

Thank you, Mr. Bowman.

For the $1 million for the Boys and Girls Club, is that your recommendation would be to give that to them in one lump sum rather than dividing it up as we've done sometimes in the past?

And so we would work with Jacob Sumner, our assistant policy of partnerships and others, and the Boys and Girls Club who we're already in contact with to make sure that we're structuring that in a way that is kind of meeting all of those needs.

But anyway, thank you very much.

Supervisor Andrews?

None other than hoping we do.

I can't hear you very well.

None other than hoping we do eventually do some renovation of fields.

Do you want to discuss that?

I think we need to consider putting some money in this budget to renovate soccer fields.

Anything you want to propose?

Well, I need some guidance as to what we can do short of the options that we were previously discussing, none of which were acceptable enough to the board.

We're not going to let you get away.

Chair Price, I wanted to see if there were additional comments or questions on this before I responded.

Supervisor McKeel?

I'm good, thanks.

Supervisor Mallek?

I do not have anything extra right now, thank you.

Supervisor LaPisto-Kirtley?

The fields issue the condition of Darden Towe fields to bringing up to a playable level of maintenance of the fields, yes.

So to you Mr. Henry.

but we certainly could do, look at, if the board would like us to look at something that is not as invasive as that but still is an improvement, we'll have to assess and define what that looks like.

So at a minimum, in order to have the variability of field usage, you'd be looking at no less than eight to ten grass fields to provide the same playing that you'd get from four artificial.

Okay.

Any other?

I'm sorry, I don't have a better answer for that, but I think that that is where we're at today.

Good evening.

I just wanted to make sure there was that awareness.

I think at this point it's clear that we're not going to be able to reach anything more than just expressing a desire for more information.

Will we have that in time for next meeting or not?

I would doubt that.

Got it.

So I think we will need to suggest what that scope is to make sure we have boards to manage expectations on what that is in order to meet the board's expectation.

I'll turn to our clerk to see, do we have anyone signed up for this?

We have one online speaker.

All right, we have one online sign up, so I will turn over to Vice Chair LaPisto-Kirtley to read the speaker procedural rules.

If by Zoom please remain muted until you are called to speak.

the President.

And so with that, Chair Price, I'm going to turn it back over to you for any questions the board may have and also to open up the two different public hearings.

Supervisor Mallek?

No questions, thank you.

Kirk Bowers.

Kirk Bowers is ready.

Good evening.

And finally, per my estimate, it would take over 30 years for operating costs to maintain grass fields to exceed the additional cost of constructing turf fields.

If you have not been able to complete your remarks, you are invited to email them to the clerk for inclusion in the record.

Thank you so much.

Our next speaker, Don Long.

Mr. Long is ready Good evening Mr. Long

Thank you.

Thank you again for all your time and your service.

Supervisor Andrews?

No additional comments.

Supervisor McKeel.

No comments.

Supervisor Mallek.

No.

And I have none either.

Do we have anyone signed up?

We do not.

Supervisor Andrews?

No comments.

Supervisor McKeel?

No comments.

Supervisor Malek?

No, thank you.

That will take place on May 4th.

Supervisor Andrews?

None at this time.

Supervisor McKeel?

No.

Supervisor Malek?

No, thank you.

Wear your mask as you feel appropriate, get your boosters, and I have nothing further at this time.

All right, thank you.

Thank you everyone.